Shoreham from inside the order to Dieppe; Henry after that visits France, John remaining in

He had been at the most 21 and perhaps young than just whenever their child Joanna came to be. She may very well was in fact this new earliest of all the youngsters the guy fathered by his certain mistresses.

John grew up in December 1167

1187 June - John when you look at the France whenever Chateauroux had been besieged 1187 June 23 - truce 1188 Jan. 29 - Henry productivity to help you The united kingdomt, possibly which have John into the pull 1188 Summer - Henry delivers John back into , crosses out-of 1189 Summer a dozen - John from the Le Mans when disarmed of the Henry's buy, then John escaped otherwise is contributed out getting safety 1189 July 6 - Henry I passes away within the France 1189 Aug. a dozen - Richard will bring John to The united kingdomt that have your 1189 Aug. 30 - John hitched tavata Israel-naisia so you're able to Isabelle off Gloucester at Marlebridge 1189 September. step three - Richard crowned on Westminster Abbey 1189 Oct. - Richard directs John into the Wales so you can subdue the fresh rebellious Welsh 1190 Feb. - John summoned so you're able to and you may forced toward oath not to put base towards the England for three many years 1190 June - Richard continues on campaign [John trips his oath] For the purposes, it is thought that the first several months, additionally the really probably time for Joanna to own already been conceived, 's the 1187-9 months. 1187 - John spends around the entire year for the France 1188 - John might have gone back to The united kingdomt into the January, but because of the summer is distributed to France, in which he appears to have remained 1189 - John appears to be when you look at the France January - August, coming back so you can The united kingdomt inside August in preparation getting his wedding to the 31 Aug. In the event the John produced no longer unrecorded productivity so you're able to England, it appears that the guy spent in the 80% out-of his day out of January 1187 until their marriage, in France . He was will eventually considering the County out-of Mortain, within the (prior to Richard's coronation).

The above mentioned information, given the months while the fact that Joanna are put so you can England out-of France inside the 1203 getting her relationship to help you Llywelyn, lends credence to your idea that Joanna along with her mom was indeed from French/Norman provider.

Offered plus John's really-understood philandering during this time, around appears to be many applicants into the part of mommy regarding Joanna!

My past article gave the information that Paget showed that they was Clemence de Dauntsey, whom hitched Nicholas de- Verdun. I considered that this was new Nicholas and you will Clementia to whom Henry 111 supplied brand new child custody out-of Susanna (due to the fact an excellent hostage) in the 1228. After another enough time browse although not, I could get a hold of no shade of a good Clemence de- Dauntsey inside the this new suggestions. I did so select yet not, new advice of a single genealogist exactly who demonstrably mentioned it as…’ I think that individuals (the newest genealogists) have established that there try zero like people because the Clemence de Dauntsey. You to definitely character of your wife of Nicholas de- Verdun try good error because of the Paget!’

I’m prepared to believe that completion, because then studies of your own information of your second Clemence turned-out way more fruitful.

Normandy

Clemence le Boteler came to be on 1175 within the Steeple Lavington, Wiltshire. Their unique dad are Philip le Boteler (created circa 1150).

Clemence le Boteler hitched Nicholas de Verdun during the 1202 (their second partner once his marriage so you can Joan Fitz Piers. Mention, this wedding isn’t shown) in the Alton, Staffordshire in addition they got one youngster, Rohese de- Verdun who had been created inside 1203 otherwise 1205 (passed away. Feb 1247).

If the, in reality, Joanna is actually the consequence of a great liaison between John and you may Clemence le Boteler (who does was basically aged doing fourteen-fifteen at that time), it could was in fact quite difficult into the Le Boteler family to track down an appropriate husband having Clemence. Indeed some a decade admission ahead of a beneficial ily?) with a trustworthy English nobleman and you can assets manager, Nicholas de- Verdun. Making aside for now the possibility that Nicholas got dropped in love with the fresh new twenty seven year-old Clemence and you can wanted to get married her, it can was indeed very important to John to incorporate Clemence that have particular possessions out-of her very own to make sure that she turned into a attractive honor getting their particular husband to be.